Comments on: The Gods Aren’t Angry? http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/ Where Introvert Meets Internet Sat, 24 Dec 2011 04:18:33 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Greg http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-819 Greg Wed, 06 Apr 2011 20:39:04 +0000 http://www.corbystephens.com/?p=172#comment-819 I am actually a huge fan of David Guzik. I have listened to nearly every sermon he has ever preached (Including audio from his Bible commentaries (and use his commentaries everytime I lead a Bible Study), and his lecture to his German students when he was a professor at Calvary Bible college. It usually takes twice as long, because I would have to listen to the German translator translate his talk into German). I live in Connecticut, and go to a local non-denominational Church. But If I lived on the West coast, anywhere Close to Santa Barbara, I would be at his Church in a Heart Beat. So I saw an article talking about Rob Bell's New book, and just searched for the tags "Rob Bell David Guzik", to see if Pastor David had wrote about it. (Although I pretty much know how he stands on the debate Theologically, and practically) And you were one of the Sites that came up with that tag. Interestingly enough, He did write a rebuttal, although very grace filled and fair, on one of Brian McLarens books. I saw that you were a pastor and talking about Rob Bell, and just read what you wrote, and for some reason the idea of sin and rebellion distinction/link just struck a chord. You are a very talented writer, I look forward to reading more of your articles when I get some time. I am actually a huge fan of David Guzik. I have listened to nearly every sermon he has ever preached (Including audio from his Bible commentaries (and use his commentaries everytime I lead a Bible Study), and his lecture to his German students when he was a professor at Calvary Bible college. It usually takes twice as long, because I would have to listen to the German translator translate his talk into German). I live in Connecticut, and go to a local non-denominational Church. But If I lived on the West coast, anywhere Close to Santa Barbara, I would be at his Church in a Heart Beat.
So I saw an article talking about Rob Bell’s New book, and just searched for the tags “Rob Bell David Guzik”, to see if Pastor David had wrote about it. (Although I pretty much know how he stands on the debate Theologically, and practically) And you were one of the Sites that came up with that tag. Interestingly enough, He did write a rebuttal, although very grace filled and fair, on one of Brian McLarens books. I saw that you were a pastor and talking about Rob Bell, and just read what you wrote, and for some reason the idea of sin and rebellion distinction/link just struck a chord. You are a very talented writer, I look forward to reading more of your articles when I get some time.

]]> By: Corby http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-818 Corby Wed, 06 Apr 2011 20:23:11 +0000 http://www.corbystephens.com/?p=172#comment-818 Greg, exactly. Well put. Personally, I don't like an overemphasis on either predestination/grace/faith or choice/act. Simply put, it's both. To me, arguing about the mechanics almost reduces it to mechanics when that isn't the point. The point is communion with the Father through Jesus by means of the Holy Spirit. It's about relationship. God related to us so that we could relate to Him. That just blows my mind! When I sin, the act of sin is/was/will be removed before the foundation of the world. Yet, in the present, I need to repent and reconcile, just as if I had done something to offend my wife, a friend, a parent, etc. Anyway, thanks for reading. How did you find this anyway? Greg, exactly. Well put. Personally, I don’t like an overemphasis on either predestination/grace/faith or choice/act. Simply put, it’s both.

To me, arguing about the mechanics almost reduces it to mechanics when that isn’t the point. The point is communion with the Father through Jesus by means of the Holy Spirit. It’s about relationship. God related to us so that we could relate to Him. That just blows my mind!

When I sin, the act of sin is/was/will be removed before the foundation of the world. Yet, in the present, I need to repent and reconcile, just as if I had done something to offend my wife, a friend, a parent, etc.

Anyway, thanks for reading. How did you find this anyway?

]]> By: Greg http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-817 Greg Wed, 06 Apr 2011 20:06:21 +0000 http://www.corbystephens.com/?p=172#comment-817 Thanks for the Clarification Corby. I Think what struck me most about what you wrote in the article, Is how Rebellion is dealt differently than Sin (in a sorts). I think of the prophets of old, and King David in Psalm 51. How are they made right before God, before Jesus came in the flesh. Obviously, it is only the Finished work of the Christ on the cross, That can take away their sin (Predestination/Grace/Faith), yet it is there humility, repentance, and Love for God that appeases their rebellion (Choice/Act). I am in no way insinuating that it isn't God who is involved in both these circumstances, but just an interesting example of God's Sovereignty and our Choice/response to him. Thanks for the Clarification Corby. I Think what struck me most about what you wrote in the article, Is how Rebellion is dealt differently than Sin
(in a sorts). I think of the prophets of old, and King David in Psalm 51. How are they made right before God, before Jesus came in the flesh. Obviously, it is only the Finished work of the Christ on the cross, That can take away their sin (Predestination/Grace/Faith), yet it is there humility, repentance, and Love for God that appeases their rebellion (Choice/Act). I am in no way insinuating that it isn’t God who is involved in both these circumstances, but just an interesting example of God’s Sovereignty and our Choice/response to him.

]]> By: Corby http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-816 Corby Wed, 06 Apr 2011 15:53:53 +0000 http://www.corbystephens.com/?p=172#comment-816 Hey Greg. No, I didn't derive that from a systematic theology book or specific part of scripture. Having said that, now that I think through it, I have to say that I never thought of them as specifically or uniquely linked. While a thing can be a kind of sin, sin is also the source of a thing. Using this as an example, rebellion is a form of sin, just like adultery, murder, etc. Sin is also the source of rebellion, adultery, and murder. Looking at it from that perspective means that there are two components; sin, which is the root/source, and the specific manifestation of sin, be it rebellion, etc. I I think passages like Psalm 51 (quoted above) and Titus 2:11-14 bear this out. Our sin nature needs to be dealt with, and sins need to be repented of. (How's that for ending statements with prepositions?!) I would add Romans 6 to that list as well. As I said, Jesus deals with our sin nature, while we need to walk in the Spirit so as to not give place to the flesh (Galatians 5:16+). Hey Greg. No, I didn’t derive that from a systematic theology book or specific part of scripture. Having said that, now that I think through it, I have to say that I never thought of them as specifically or uniquely linked. While a thing can be a kind of sin, sin is also the source of a thing.

Using this as an example, rebellion is a form of sin, just like adultery, murder, etc. Sin is also the source of rebellion, adultery, and murder. Looking at it from that perspective means that there are two components; sin, which is the root/source, and the specific manifestation of sin, be it rebellion, etc. I

I think passages like Psalm 51 (quoted above) and Titus 2:11-14 bear this out. Our sin nature needs to be dealt with, and sins need to be repented of. (How’s that for ending statements with prepositions?!) I would add Romans 6 to that list as well. As I said, Jesus deals with our sin nature, while we need to walk in the Spirit so as to not give place to the flesh (Galatians 5:16+).

]]> By: Greg http://www.corbystephens.com/2008/08/15/the-gods-arent-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-815 Greg Wed, 06 Apr 2011 13:33:19 +0000 http://www.corbystephens.com/?p=172#comment-815 You Wrote: "Having said that, is God angry? Yes. At what? Sin and rebellion. Does that need appeasement? Yes. The rebellion can be appeased by humility, repentance, and love for God. Sin is another matter. We cannot make appeasement or atonement for that. It wasn’t our idea that sin needs to be paid for, it was God’s. He told us this. How is God appeased when it comes to sin? How does this happen if we can’t do it? Simple; God does it for us. How? Via Jesus on the cross and in His resurrection." I never quite heard of sin and rebellion being separated like that. Did you derive that from a specific Systematic Theology book, or some part of Scripture? It was a very interesting thought, I'd like to see how it was derived. You Wrote:
“Having said that, is God angry? Yes. At what? Sin and rebellion. Does that need appeasement? Yes. The rebellion can be appeased by humility, repentance, and love for God. Sin is another matter. We cannot make appeasement or atonement for that. It wasn’t our idea that sin needs to be paid for, it was God’s. He told us this. How is God appeased when it comes to sin? How does this happen if we can’t do it? Simple; God does it for us. How? Via Jesus on the cross and in His resurrection.”

I never quite heard of sin and rebellion being separated like that. Did you derive that from a specific Systematic Theology book, or some part of Scripture? It was a very interesting thought, I’d like to see how it was derived.

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